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Bryce Battisti


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 12
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I'm using Version 2.0 beta1b12.
I have just begun to add meta data to the nodes and want to be sure i can search by both categories and keywords when the time comes. I have found the keyword search function works perfecty, but the category+keyword search never seems to come up with any results and there is no option to search for categories only.
Is this feature under development?
melanie st.james


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 124
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Hi Bryce,

We have been debugging the Search tool. The latest build should address some of these issues.

When you write "search for categories only", would you want to search for example the applied category "creator" only, or "creator" + "name"?

Thanks for your feedback,

Melanie
Bryce Battisti


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 12
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I don't know what you mean by "creator" or "creator"+"name". Those terms don't have any meaning for me in relation to concept maps. I want to be able to search my maps by category and by keyword and have only the results show on the screen. When I do so with the 'results' selector set to 'show' the search returns no results. It seems to work fine when I have the 'results' selector set to 'hide' or 'copy to new map'. I'm using VUE 2.0 beta 1b25 today.
Daniel Heller


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 24
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Are you creating your keywords using the "assign keywords" option in the info panel?

If you don't assign the category name to a particular keyword value through the info panel, then the "category+keyword" search should usually produce no results

I'm wondering if we are all on the same page as to the meaning of "category" however..

as an example of the current system of thinking about this:

"creator" can be a category name for any keyword value you choose..
Daniel Heller


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 24
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typo is last reply:

I meant to say:

with the "assign categories" option (in the checkbox) applied
(keyword values always are visible -- drop down menus for category names are only available when this box is checked)
melanie st.james


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 124
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I will echo Dan in wondering if "we are all on the same page with the meaning of categories"...

The current "categories" are the Dublin Core metadata schema. We will be adding GUI to enable / disable the Dublin Core and MARK metadata schemas. We are also thinking about creating VUE specific "categories".

Which ones would be useful to you? Can you explain in detail how you expect the categories to work and how you would want to search them? This would help us greatly!
Bryce Battisti


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 12
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thanks for both of your responses. I have been creating my own categories by checking the "assign categories" in the 'keywords' box in the info pane.
I am in the process of writing my dissertation and I am using VUE to organize, code and otherwise make sense of my data. It helps me to be able to move chunks of data related to particular topics around the screen. It would also help to be able to assign categories to each concept on the map so that I can search for just the concepts relevant to the particular topic i am writing on.
This seems to work fine for the 'keywords', but I want a higher order of organization for my 'keywords'. Hence I would like to like to label a node as pertaining to question 1 (the 'category') and sub-question 2 (the 'keyword'). Is this possible, or do I need to assign a unique 'keyword' to each sub-question and just search by those?
Daniel Heller


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 24
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Glad to hear that the category and "assign categories" could be useful to you, or at least is sparking ideas for you, that could help us better improve the product.

If I am understanding correctly, it sounds like you would be able to search for a keyword *anything* with "question 1" category which I think may not be currently supported in the UI, though it is a very interesting use case and should be theoretically possible to support.

It may also be possible to currently get a very similar effect in our current build by using the ontology feature and an "everything search".. though to do this effectively you would also need to create your own custom ontology containing the question names (most easily in an ontology editor such as Protege). Ontology type is one of the criteria that currently should be getting counted under "everything" if things are working correctly -- in fact I just tried a small test map and this appears to be working with default basic "everything search" in the current build.

hope this helps,

dan H
Daniel Heller


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 24
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Glad to hear that the category and "assign categories" could be useful to you, or at least is sparking ideas for you, that could help us better improve the product.

If I am understanding correctly, it sounds like you would be able to search for a keyword *anything* with "question 1" category which I think may not be currently supported in the UI, though it is a very interesting use case and should be theoretically possible to support.

It may also be possible to currently get a very similar effect in our current build by using the ontology feature and an "everything search".. though to do this effectively you would also need to create your own custom ontology containing the question names (most easily in an ontology editor such as Protege). Ontology type is one of the criteria that currently should be getting counted under "everything" if things are working correctly -- in fact I just tried a small test map and this appears to be working with default basic "everything search" in the current build.

hope this helps,

dan H
Daniel Heller


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 24
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(oops! sorry for the multiple post above..)

In rereading your post, I'm wondering if this is something one should expect to be able to do from "categories and keywords" advanced search and if you are seeing a bug in this feature? (i.e. a particular search that isn't working the way you expect?) Or is the issue that you want to assign the same category/keyword pair to a "chunk" of data at once? (instead of having to click on each node separately, sometimes just to add the same values?) We are working on trying to support that feature soon, if that is the case..

It certainly would be great to figure out we can help you not have to assign unique custom keywords to each node, if it doesn't seem that it should to you that it should be necessary...

Bryce Battisti


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 12
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Daniel,
I'd upload my map so you could see for yourself, but the MyMaps feature appears not to be working on the website. It's surprisingly difficult to know whether we are understanding each other correctly. I think this comment of yours comes closest to what I am talking about:

"If I am understanding correctly, it sounds like you would be able to search for a keyword *anything* with "question 1" category which I think may not be currently supported in the UI, though it is a very interesting use case and should be theoretically possible to support".

In saying this is 'theoretically possible' are you saying it might actually get done or just that there's no reason it could't be done. If keywords are not nested (hierachically) within categories then I don't understand why VUE uses both. Why not just have keywords or just have categories?
I haven't looked into the ontology feature, nor do I have any background with ontologies. Do you think that would be a better feature to familiarize myself with for my needs?
Daniel Heller


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 24
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theoretically possible means: "I think there is no reason it couldn't be done" (but its not currently on our task list)

I'll send along offline some information about how you can get us a copy of the map.
Bryce Battisti


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 12
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Thanks again for the phone conversation the other day. while talking about the search function I mentioned that I considered the color of my map nodes as a form of metadata. To expand on that, I think it would be nice to be able to search on my maps for particular types of nodes. I'd like to be able to to have the search function return results by node color, shape, and presence or absence of various types of linked files.
melanie st.james


Joined: 08/08/2008 11:36:13
Messages: 124
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This type of functionality has been part of our conversations for a while now. Although it won't be in our final VUE 2 release, we hope we will be able to integrate it at some point in the future.

It's helpful to know you would find it useful.

I will copy your suggestion over to the wish list section, as not to loose sight of it.
 
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